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		<title>TidBITS: Comments on LiveCode Crowdfunds Free, Open-Source Update</title>
		<link>http://tidbits.com/</link>
		<description>LiveCode, a development environment inspired by HyperCard, may add a free edition and release its code under an open-source license, if owner RunRev meets the goal for its Kickstarter campaign by the end of February. For many, the promise of a free version of LiveCode and its code being available to view, modify, and distribute in changed form is compelling; others find controversial the amount of money sought and other details about the project.</description>
		<language>en-us</language>
		<copyright>Copyright 2013 TidBITS Publishing Inc.</copyright>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2013 00:00:00 EST</pubDate>
		<lastBuildDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2013 00:00:00 EST</lastBuildDate>
		<managingEditor>editors@tidbits.com (TidBITS Editors)</managingEditor>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Adam Engst]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17834</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2013 10:45:51 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17834</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Adam Engst)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[RunRev's wrap-up blog post...<br><br><a href="http://blog.runrev.com/blog/bid/272739/We-Kickstarted-LiveCode">http://blog.runrev.com/blog/bid/272739/We-Kickstarted-LiveCode</a>]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Adam Engst]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17832</link>
			<pubDate>Thu, 28 Feb 2013 06:28:23 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17832</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Adam Engst)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[In the end, the LiveCode Kickstarter project not only funded with 35 hours to go, but blew past the goal in the last day, hitting a grand total of £493,795, or more than all the company's "stretch goals" (things they promised to do upon hitting additional funding levels).<br><br><a href="http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1755283828/open-source-edition-of-livecode/posts">http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1755283828/open-source-edition-of-livecode/posts</a><br><br>Bring on that open source version, guys!]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Curt Ford]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17820</link>
			<pubDate>Wed, 27 Feb 2013 11:23:13 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17820</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Curt Ford)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Michael, <br><br>I'd agree with Ben that it's much improved lately, and with the success of the Kickstarter project there's tremendous potential. Incidentally, if you look at p. 3 of the comments on the LiveCode Kickstarter page, you'll see that several of the original HyperCard team have given their enthusiastic support.. sounds like a real vote of confidence to me.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Ben Rubinstein]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17792</link>
			<pubDate>Tue, 26 Feb 2013 00:57:58 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17792</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Ben Rubinstein)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Hi Michael - I'm sorry you had that experience - I'd urge you to try again (especially if the Kickstarter succeeds and you can do it for free!).  I've spent many many thousands with RunRev, and was dedicated at reporting bugs at the period when there were lots of them, and it has improved enormously, as have their quality systems.  It's not perfect, there's still a hump to get over, but it's definitely worth trying.<br><br>Some witness statements:<br>http://livecode1001.blogspot.co.uk/<br><br>I certainly do believe you're still running a HyperCard database - and that it's getting problematic - and LiveCode could help you bring it back into full life.  I recommend you give it another go.<br>]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Motorcycle Michael]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17783</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 25 Feb 2013 19:10:43 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17783</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Motorcycle Michael)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[I can't tell you how great it is to even see the name HyperCard again. Bill Atkinson's description of it as a "software erector set" was an understatement to say the least, some likened it to man's discovery of fire. Wrote many databases back in the day, including one that ran our fire department for a few years. Was a lot of fun, an awesome teaching tool, the killer app for nearly anything. Believe it or not, I'm still running a HyperCard database I put together in 1997 (on a dedicated G4) even tho printing from it has become problematic.<br><br>Having spent hundreds of dollars on RunRev, including purchase of an outdated manual from them, it never operated as advertised. Awful interface, buggy and unstable, it was an expensive, time-consuming failure that left a bad taste to this day. I'm afraid there'll never be another HyperCard; was years ahead of its time.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Adam Engst]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17774</link>
			<pubDate>Mon, 25 Feb 2013 14:01:48 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17774</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Adam Engst)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Nice translation of this into Polish at <a href="http://cheap.de/science/zyc-funduszy-crowd-code-free-open-source-aktualizacja">http://cheap.de/science/zyc-funduszy-crowd-code-free-open-source-aktualizacja</a>]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from David Simpson]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17753</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 20:42:04 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17753</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (David Simpson)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[There is a very informative road map blog posting written by Mark Waddingham, the RunRev CTO. In this blog posting, he explains how the process of refactoring the LiveCode engine will be accomplished. The diagrams show how dramatic a change this will be. Effectively, you can think of this effort as being like developing a kernel based operating system. You might think of it as being similar to the difference between MacOS 9 compared to MacOS X.<br><br>http://blog.runrev.com/blog/bid/266941/Taming-the-Monolith]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Colin Holgate]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17751</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 18:02:57 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17751</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Colin Holgate)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[At the time that the WildCard beta would have been going on, I had still not started to use Macintosh! I was though an early adaptor for HyperCard, so I don't feel too bad...]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Michael E. Cohen]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17739</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 15:14:47 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17739</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Michael E. Cohen)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Me, too. In fact, in its beta days, when it was called WildCard (I think I still have the disks in a box somewhere). [Hi, Peter!!]]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Monte Goulding]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17738</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 13:21:11 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17738</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Monte Goulding)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[And have since been busy maintaining it, adding features and platforms to it. It has probably taken years of part-time discussions and thought to come to the point where they have a solid plan for this major refactoring. It is a complete overhaul and will enable them to move forward in much more significant ways, however, I'd be very surprised if they had the funds to make this a top priority without being kickstarted. There are just too many other things that need to be done to keep customers happy.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Colin Holgate]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17737</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 11:08:39 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17737</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Colin Holgate)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Matt isn't the only person to think the same thing, and RunRev have a lengthy FAQ and ongoing Q&A to allay such concerns.<br><br>Something else to know is that many of us pledgers know the RunRev team personally, having met them at conferences. We all like and trust them, and we have daily contact and input to what they are developing.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Colin Holgate]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17736</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 11:03:28 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17736</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Colin Holgate)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Small correction of something Peter said: it was 1987 that he started with HyperCard (same for me).]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Glenn Fleishman]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17735</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 11:03:27 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17735</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Glenn Fleishman)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[RunRev acquired MetaCard in 2003, 10 years ago.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Peter Bogdanoff]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17734</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 10:41:06 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17734</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Peter Bogdanoff)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[I started using HyperCard back in 1997, also at Voyager (working on the CD Companion Series of music programs). In college, I had taken a semester of Basic and a quarter of Cobol (!!!), and later a half-semester of C. HyperTalk, along with HyperCard's pre-made user interface elements was a breeze compared to any of those. LiveCode is now HyperCard plus things HyperCard wasn't ever able to provide or do very well. In recent years I dabbled with Objective C for iOS programming--Oi!! Then I discovered that LiveCode makes iOS apps from basically the same warm and friendly code used for desktops--sweet! Now I'm working on music projects using LiveCode for both desktops and mobile. In my strongly biased, but experienced opinion, this Kickstarter campaign for LiveCode is well-worth supporting.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Mark Wieder]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17733</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 10:18:28 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17733</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Mark Wieder)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[...bait taken...<br><br>RunRev didn't write the engine, they bought the rights to it a few years ago.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Mark Wieder]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17732</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 10:15:41 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17732</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Mark Wieder)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[RunRev has had a very conservative approach to making changes to the engine code over the years because of the possibility of cascading problems due to dependencies. The KS project will give them the much-needed flexibility to clean up the code before release. A small company doesn't have the revenue stream to devote to a project like this without going to outside funding, and Kickstarter gives RunRev the opportunity to avoid going the VC route.<br><br>HyperCard was what opened up the Mac for me after years of being a commandline programmer, and finally got me to dive into the Macintosh toolbox. The LiveCode engine is a solid tool, and an open source version would be great.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Matt Neuburg]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17731</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 10:07:58 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17731</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Matt Neuburg)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[Some of us are inclined to take a more cynical view of RunRev's move here. If the goal is to open the source to public view, just open it and then we'll see what's what. If the goal is to write less crufty code, well, that is what they should have been doing all along: they are very much a for-profit enterprise, and it was their job to use wisely in the first place the money they've been making all this time by writing their code decently as they went along. Why do they deserve a free capital injection to make up for their own bad practices? Isn't this talk of "open source" just a form of politically correct-sounding bait?]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from Colin Holgate]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17729</link>
			<pubDate>Sat, 23 Feb 2013 07:35:27 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17729</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (Colin Holgate)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[I was the programmer of Voyager's Expanded Books, and co-programmer of the Expanded Books Toolkit. I hadn't heard about William Gibson doing a pledge, but it makes more sense than most people could guess. The reason being that we made expanded books out of his novels, and on one speaking tour he even read to the audience from the HyperCard stack running on his PowerBook!]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Comment from phoenix]]></title>
			<link>http://db.tidbits.com/article/13582?rss#comments_17725</link>
			<pubDate>Fri, 22 Feb 2013 16:57:51 EST</pubDate>
			<guid>http://tidbits.com/article/13582#comments_17725</guid>
			<author><![CDATA[comments@tidbits.com (phoenix)]]></author>
			<description><![CDATA[If supporters prove able to raise the $534,000 needed to revamp the LiveCode tangle of 20 year old legacy spaghetti code, I QA'd that kind of code for 17 years for a living, and I can testify it should be well worth it.<br><br>I fell in love with HyperCard early and subscribed to the original TidBITS stacks. I learned to code in HyperCard before moving on to C and Perl for my private projects and web apps. A web interface works superbly for my needs these days, but my first love, so to speak, will always be HyperCard.]]></description>
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